Why Platform Marketing Took 2 Years To Work (But It Was Worth It)

Richelle Dopp:  When I go into a listing appointment with the marketing guide for Platform, it's like I can guarantee more people are gonna see your house with me than with someone else, you know? I have listing videos, I have over a hundred thousand views on 'em. So it's like I can show those, and those numbers, and it makes a huge advantage.

Tim Chermak: This is the Platform Marketing Show, where we interview the most creative and ambitious real estate agents in the country, dissect their local marketing strategy, and get the behind-the-scenes scoop on how they're generating listing leads and warm referrals. We'll dive into the specifics of what marketing campaigns are working for them, how much they're spending on those campaigns, and figure out how they have perfected what we call the Platform Marketing strategy.

This is your host, Tim Chermak. I'm the founder and CEO of Platform. I love marketing, and I talk too much. So let's dive in. 

Tim Chermak: Hey guys, it's Tim Chermak, and welcome back to another episode of the Platform Marketing Show. I'm joined today by Richelle Dopp, who's in kind of the Salt Lake City area in Utah. Richelle, welcome to the show!

Richelle Dopp:  Thanks so much! 

Tim Chermak: So I know that you're in Layton, which is a little bit north of Salt Lake City, but generally, you serve the broader Salt Lake City area, and your best year ever was 2021. We were talking before the show that a lot of agents, if you ask them what was your best year ever they'll say 2021, because that's when interest rates bottomed out and everyone was stir crazy from COVID and people were moving and wanting to buy a house with a bigger yard or a house with more land, whatever, 'cause they were, like I said, just getting stir crazy during all the lockdowns and many agents seem to have their best year ever in 2021. You joined Platform, was it 2023? 

Richelle Dopp:  Yeah. 

Tim Chermak: Or 2022? 

Richelle Dopp: Yeah, it was March. March of 2023. 

Tim Chermak: Okay. So 2023 is when you officially got started with this Platform Marketing strategy. This year, you are on pace to do $20 million or more. You said you actually might finish the year, depending on how a couple of things shake out, you might actually end the year at $25 (million) or potentially even $30 million. But for sure, you're pretty confident you're gonna hit somewhere between $20 and $25 million.

Again, your best year ever previously was $10 million. So your business has absolutely grown, but it didn't happen quickly. It's not like this all happened overnight or even frankly, within your first six months of this Platform strategy. 

My first question is, when did you feel like, when you started all this new marketing stuff, when did you feel like, “Okay, I feel like I'm kind of hitting some momentum here. It's starting to work”?

Richelle Dopp: Oh, it was slow for me. I mean, I got a few things. I think I got my first listing from someone that I was an acquaintance of but I didn't really know ‘em in October of ‘23. She called me and said, “Hey, I want you to come list my house.” And the only reason she knew I was an agent was 'cause of Facebook and Platform.

Tim Chermak: So that was about six months into…?

Richelle Dopp: Yeah. Yeah.

Tim Chermak: Okay.

Richelle Dopp: And then I closed a buyer lead from one of my lead sheets in December of ‘23. So it was just kind of slow. I’d say it really started just getting really… I noticed a major uptick in September of ‘24, so it was almost 18 months before I really was like going crazy. 

Tim Chermak: Yeah, where you're like, this isn't just paying for itself. It's not just breaking even, but it actually noticeably has a good ROI at this point. 

Richelle Dopp: Yes. Yeah, definitely. 

Tim Chermak: I think it's really important to discuss that 'cause sometimes we highlight the stories and we highlight the clients that are like, “Oh my god, my business doubled in six months,” or these crazy early success stories. But the reality is that most people who are gonna pursue a strategy like this, which is about building a brand and content marketing and kind of playing this long-term game of building your brand and your community, that's something that doesn't create overnight results, right? If you get results in 90 days, you are the exception, not the rule. 

Richelle Dopp: Yeah. And I remember listening to a bunch of these other podcasts and hearing people just do it fast. And I was like, what is up with my market? I'm doing what I'm supposed to, it's just not working. I just took longer.

Tim Chermak: And how many people are in the greater Salt Lake area? I'm assuming it's a couple of million. 

Richelle Dopp: Yeah. I honestly don't know. But yeah, definitely a couple million. I can look it up really quick. 

Tim Chermak: Yeah, well, I'm assuming it's a couple million 'cause obviously it's a major metro area. And I think that's one of the misconceptions, is that some people think, “Oh, I've heard a bunch of Platform case studies and they're in small towns, and so I just don't think I can ever achieve that level of success because I'm not in a small town.”

And I think when you're in a small town, it's two sides of a coin. There's a plus and a minus. The plus is that you'll reach saturation a lot faster, and so you're more likely to be recognized if you're going out grocery shopping or you go to church or whatever. You're more likely to be recognized if you do this Platform Marketing strategy in a smaller town just because of math, right?

Richelle Dopp: Oh yeah, definitely. 

Tim Chermak: If you live in a town with 40,000 or 50,000 people, you're more likely to be recognized when you're out and about, which is kind of fun when that happens 'cause you're like, “Oh cool, the marketing's working. People actually recognize me.” But the downside to being in a small town is that there's way less opportunities for the marketing to work because there's obviously a lot less transactions happening at any given time in a town with 50,000 people as there is in an area with 500,000 people.

Richelle Dopp: Right, definitely. Yeah. 

Tim Chermak: And all things being equal, in some cases balances out. You have more opportunity, but also it's diluted a little bit, but it took you longer, right? 

Richelle Dopp: Oh, for sure. 

Tim Chermak: You're for sure 18 months in, if not two years in, 'cause you're now basically just passed your two-year anniversary at Platform. 

Richelle Dopp: Yeah. 

Tim Chermak: And now this year, you can truthfully say, “Holy cow, I'm on pace to more than double.” Not just more than double what you did last year, but more than double what you did in your best year ever. And let's be real, the real estate market in 2025 isn't even close to an apples - apples comparison to what it was like in 2021. 

Richelle Dopp: Oh, definitely. 

Tim Chermak: So, I like to play this hypothetical of imagine you had all of this marketing dialed in going into 2021.

Richelle Dopp: It would have been nuts.

Tim Chermak: Yeah, you would've sold like $50 million, right?

Richelle Dopp: Right.

Tim Chermak: So I mean, that's incredible that you're having that good of a year in this down of a market because most agents in 2025, when we're recording this, they're straight up struggling. It's a hard, high-interest-rate market. The Fed just had their meeting actually yesterday, and there was no rate cuts in May, and they don't seem like they're looking to cut rates in June. There's kind of some disagreement with that back and forth, but when you look at the fundamentals of the economy right now, with unemployment where it's at, and inflation, it would be frankly surprising if they cut rates in any major way in the next six months. They might cut rates 25 bps or something, but that's not gonna move the needle on housing sales if rates go down that little.

Richelle Dopp: Yeah, I agree.

Tim Chermak: And frankly, the last time they cut rates, mortgage rates went up. 

Richelle Dopp: Yeah, I remember that. It was bad. 

Tim Chermak: Yeah, that was the fall of last year. They cut rates pretty significantly, and then mortgage rates actually went up because bond investors just didn't trust the numbers. And they're like, “No, we actually want more money to buy mortgage bonds now.” 

So I guess the macro environment that we're in is kind of hostile to real estate agents right now, and yet you're having this epic year. I'm sure most agents in your office, in your area. wish they had a business like yours now, where you're gonna be selling $20 million plus.

Tell me a little bit about your market. What is the median price point? What is your average price point? What's the days on market? What does that look like for where you're at? 

Richelle Dopp: So median price point, like $550,000, we're pretty high. So my average is probably pretty close to that. I do have a couple bigger ones, like I have one right now that's $2.75 million, which is my most expensive listing ever. But most of it is in the fives or sixes. 

Tim Chermak: Okay. Are homes selling quickly there? What's the days on market look like? 

Richelle Dopp: So average is like 40 days on market. Mine are selling faster than that right now, so I'm happy about that. I had one I put on the market yesterday and got an offer on this morning, so…

Tim Chermak: Wow. 

Richelle Dopp: Yeah. But most of the time, it's about 30, 40 days on market. 

Tim Chermak: Okay. So that's still a pretty strong seller's market where you're at, then. So, for you, getting listings is like the name of the game if that's the way a market is. 

Have you noticed that in the last couple of years, you're getting more listings than you previously used to get as a ratio, or has that not changed? 

Richelle Dopp: Oh, it changed significantly. I rarely did listings. In 2021, I probably had four listings. Right now, I have six current listings, and I had seven closings last week. So let’s say I’m 90% listings right now. 

Tim Chermak: Really? 90% listings. Wow.

Richelle Dopp: I mean, I never had listings before. 

Tim Chermak: Well, that's a huge success story in and of itself because not all sales volume is created equal. So if you're saying, “Hey, I'm gonna do $20 million this year and $18 million of that is listings” versus someone who's even 50-50, if it's like “I had $10 million of listings and $10 million of buyer sales,” I can tell you which agent has the higher standard of living and better work life balance. 

Richelle Dopp: Yeah, definitely. Yeah, for sure. 

Tim Chermak: So if you can build your business while you're doubling your sales volume like that, but in the doubling is like, “Hey, I'm actually doing way higher percentage of listings than I've ever been,” that's a win stacked on top of a win 'cause you're now probably making twice the money you've ever made, but you're actually working less than you did when you were maybe selling half that much. 

Richelle Dopp: Yeah. Yeah. I just had to order more signs 'cause I am running out of signs. I can't keep up with them.

Tim Chermak: That's awesome. I actually didn't know that. That's why we do these interviews, ‘cause I did not realize that you had that, “Hey, I'm doing like 90% list.” That's amazing. Good for you! 

Richelle Dopp: Yeah, thanks! Super awesome.

Tim Chermak: So why do you think that is? Why do you think that, hey, all of a sudden, I used to be an unofficial buyer's agent, even if you weren't marketing yourself that way, you were doing more buyers and sellers, and now it seems to be that you've just become this listing agent powerhouse? What change that got you to this point? 

Richelle Dopp: Part of it is, I think, time. I was a newer agent before, so part of it is time. And then a lot of it I thin,k is just the marketing. When I go into a listing appointment with the marketing guide for Platform, it's like I can guarantee more people are gonna see your house with me than with someone else. I have listing videos, I have over a hundred thousand views on 'em. So it's like I can show those, and those numbers, and it makes a huge advantage. 

And I have done some lead systems that I get more listing appointments, but then I go in and I win them. I was talking to the lady that does it, and she's normally it's like 1% to 2%, and I'm at like 8% to 10% of ones that I actually get in close. So I think that's with my marketing is just a huge advantage. 

Tim Chermak: Yeah. 'Cause you can roll into a listing appointment and just show them the numbers of “Hey, here's how much easier you're gonna get.” You can roll into a listing appointment and just talk about the amount of views that you're gonna get where most agents are like, “Yeah, I'll put a sign in the yard. I'll take professional photos. It'll be on the MLS,” and it's like, okay, but what do you do that other agents don't do? And most agents, if you ask them that question that directly, they don't have an answer to it. 

Richelle Dopp: No. They have no answer. I used to have no answer. 

Tim Chermak: So you go into a listing, you have all these metrics of the actual… You said, “I can get a hundred thousand views on a listing video,” right? That's crazy. I think that's such a powerful claim that a lot of sellers might not even believe you unless you show them the video like, “Hey, here's the proof” 'cause it's such like “Wait, what?”

Richelle Dopp: “How is that possible?”

Tim Chermak: If you go on YouTube, most listing videos that you see agents put up there are getting like 1,000 views, maybe 500 views, and so you're like, “Hey look, I got a hundred thousand on this.” What do the sellers usually say when you show them that? 

Richelle Dopp: They're just like, “Oh. Well, they told me…” because when I interview and it's another agent, and they're like, “Well, that agent told me that they put it on all these websites.” And I'm like “Well yeah, it's the IDX feed, it goes to everybody but that's very standard.” I'm like, “This is in addition to that. I'll still give you what he is giving you, but now I'm giving you this extra.” And they're just like, “Oh yeah, that makes sense. Yeah. I want you to do it.” 

Tim Chermak: Have you ever actually picked up a buyer from one of those listing campaigns where you double-ended the listing?

Richelle Dopp: No. I've had a couple of buyers, but they've never turned into anything. I've had people call me, and I've gone and shown them, but nothing that's ever stuck. 

Tim Chermak: I'm actually kind of glad you said that because I think there's kind of this misconception - I was hoping you would say that - there’s kind of a misconception of why you should be filming listing videos and agents think it's like “Oh, I want to pick up more buyers,” or “I wanna find someone to buy the listing.” And we all know if the house is priced correctly, it's gonna sell. And if it's not selling, it's frankly because it's not priced correctly, right?

Richelle Dopp: Yeah. 

Tim Chermak: You can have the coolest video in the world, and that video can get a hundred thousand views, but if the house is $30,000 overpriced, it's not gonna sell. So at the end of the day, we as real estate professionals know that as long as it's got good pictures and the house is priced reasonably accurately, it's going to sell. 

The real reason you do these listing videos and the real reason that you want to get, like you said, 100,000 video views on a listing video isn't to help that house sell. It's not even to pick up a buyer for that house like you're trying to double end it. It's because of the psychology of how you can show that to future homeowners on listing appointments of, “Look what I did with the last house,” and it helps you get more listings.

So I think it's not a coincidence at all to me. I mean, I've been running Platform now for 10 years, and I've seen this pattern over and over and over again of an agent like you who does this, and then they get more listing appointments. You get more listings, you film more epic listing videos, and that leads to even more listings and all of a sudden you wake up one day and you're like, “Holy cow! This took a couple years, but I'm on pace to double or possibly, who knows, maybe even triple my GCI from where it was a couple years ago,” and it wasn't really rocket science what you did. You just film listing videos, and you had creative marketing and you went from $10 million to $20 million to $25 million, maybe eventually you get to $30 million, and it's doing creative listing videos.

Richelle Dopp: Yep, definitely.

Tim Chermak: What are you spending on the average listing video? Do you know? Are you putting $300 or $500, or do you know how much goes into the actual ad spend budget for a listing video? 

Richelle Dopp: I have no idea. I know how much. I'm about $1,200 a month. 

Tim Chermak: Okay. 

Richelle Dopp: We front end in like first quarter and do a lot first quarter, and first quarter sometimes I'm up to over $2,000, but then I go down to $1,200 and I just give it to Taylor, who's amazing and I'm like, I don't care what you do with it. But she did say she's probably gonna have to increase me because I've just sent her three listing tours this week, so she's like, “We're probably gonna have to increase your spend.” 

Tim Chermak: Yeah. Which is fine 'cause if you're doing that much more, it's then you're gonna make more money, so it's not that big of a deal if you have to increase your budget a little bit. But I would guess it's probably $300? 

Richelle Dopp: Probably.

Tim Chermak: Although if you got 100,000 video views, that probably wasn't $300, that seems exceptional.

Richelle Dopp: That was a million-dollar listing that I had, but most of 'em are right around 80,000. I have some that are only in like 25,000, 30,000, but most of them are in the 80s. But the one that had over a hundred that I know of was a million-dollar listing. And I know we probably put more money behind that one.

Tim Chermak: That's incredible either way 'cause even if you put $500 behind that, a couple hundred dollars, if it gets you 100,000 video views and you're gonna make 25 grand on that commission…

Richelle Dopp: Yeah, it's totally worth it. 

Tim Chermak: Yeah, exactly, that is money well spent 'cause again, I want to emphasize that it's not that you spent a little bit of extra money to promote this listing because you were gonna make a bunch of money when that listing sold. It's that you're basically buying the story of “Hey, if I have to spend $500 promoting this listing to get 100,000 video views or whatever, that story to me that I can tell in the future to listings in the future on listing appointments is that, ‘Hey, look at such and such video that I got 100,000 video views on,” that's why you're doing it is in that moment that you can leverage the power of that story and that case study and that helps you get future listings.

Richelle Dopp: Yeah, definitely. 

Tim Chermak: So you're spending about $1,200 a month or so, maybe in some months you spend more if you get more listings. And that has fueled this growth of hey, growing from $10 million to over $20 million. So for those listening, that's a good ROI, right? 

Richelle Dopp: Oh yeah. 

Tim Chermak: Yeah. That's a very good financial ROI there. What are some of your other favorite ads that you've run that have seemed to get a lot of engagement, whether it's a video ad or a photo retargeting ad? Are there a couple of ads you can point to over the last several years where “Hey, this particular one really seemed to connect with my retargeting list”?

Richelle Dopp: So it's weird because I've never had one that I've really felt like… I mean, I've had some listing videos where friends and family have been like, “Oh my gosh, those are so funny,” even some of the photo ads. But nothing that strangers have ever said anything about, or none that one post took me straight to a client.

Tim Chermak: Sure. 

Richelle Dopp: But whenever I do the Mother's Day ads, the family ads - Utah's very family-oriented, family-friendly. And so the family ads usually get the most engagement. 

Tim Chermak: When you say family ad, you're literally just saying photos of me and my family, where I'm telling a personal story about something that we're doing?

Richelle Dopp: Yeah. Yeah. So we were just looking at the Mother's Day ads, trying to figure out which one we were gonna do. So we went back to see what I'd done in the past, and those ones had tons of engagement on them. 

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